Wednesday, November 05, 2008

How does that go again?

I'm not quite getting it; could you tell it to me again?

It went something like, "Kill people to solve your problems"? or maybe, "It's OK to kill old people and sick people if they're in your way"? or "People who aren't able to look after themselves should be put out of our misery"? or "Let's pressure sick people into killing themselves to save the state some money"?

I'm sorry. I just can't quite grasp what you're saying...


Anonymous said...

My state just became the second in the U.S. to approve death as 'health care'. By 59% and counting. We're obsessed with legalised murder. Pray for us.

Chimera said...

No. Not murder.

This is how it works:

If you have a terminal illness, and you decide you'd rather die cleanly and quickly and with less pain and suffering, you go to your doctor and tell him.

If he agrees with you, he writes you a prescription.

If you still want to die, you take the prescription. But up until that point, you can change your mind.

No one can force anyone top swallow hemlock against their will.

CHOICE. It's an individual's right.

Anonymous said...

That's not how it is working in Oregon. Patients have been told the state will no longer cover their pain medications at the same level, but they do have the option of some nifty little pills to end it all. They want relief from pain, not death. Cancer patients are told they will not receive the treatment determined to be best by their physician and desired by the ill person, but they can obtain & fill a lethal prescription.

Those with the least resources to find other help will find their 'choices' to be limited.

An individual's right to choice is not an isolated action that affects only the individual. It impacts society as well. The individual also has an responsibility to society, not just rights.

17-18 years ago, Washington state had a similar initiative on the ballot which lost. It won this time reflecting changing attitudes.

It could easily mean that in another 17-18 years choice becomes obligation.

Hilary Jane Margaret White said...

Thank you Chimera for stepping in with that vital distinction. Naturally, we would have remained utterly ignorant of it had you not kindly taken it upon yourself to inform us.

As always we can rely upon you to take the devil's position and articulate it with a facility worthy of the New York Times editorial style guide.

Chimera said...

"That's not how it is working in Oregon."

Actually, I hear from friends and family in Oregon that it happens exactly as I said. And that is precisely the way it has been laid out to happen in Washington.

But I guess there are all kinds of people who are afraid that it will come down to pressure to take the lethal pills, so they imagine that it is already happening.

Hilary, are you really up to giving over control of your body to someone else to decide what you may do with it? Don't you think you should have the final say?

That "devil" of yours really gets around, doesn't he? Sounds like an articulate fellow. Almost makes me wish I had one of my own to blame for everything I don't like. But I'm afraid the only use I have for New York newspaper is the Sunday Times crosswords, so I can't really relate to your comment about its editorial style. Was that an insult?

Mark S. Abeln said...

"Choice" is just rhetoric that happens to play well in the USA. Elsewhere, the operative phrase is "population control". Planned Parenthood, for example, praises Chinese population control programs, even though there is no choice in the matter. I've read enough lefty literature over the decades to know that the intellectual leaders of the movement have no love for individual men, and God save us from those who love 'mankind' in the abstract.

The sick and elderly are the most dependent and helpless part of society besides infants, and so are highly prone to exploitation like being "strongly encouraged" to commit suicide. In some places in Europe, some of these medical suicides are actually done against the will of the subject, and that is the direction progressive thinking is going.

Depression is rampant in our society, and suicide is a quite permanent solution to what may be a temporary problem. Suicide is something that ought to be strongly discouraged and certainly must not be legal.

Anonymous said...

cf: Google

"culture" "of" and "death".

Chimera said...

Mark, when I talk about CHOICE, I mean the ability and the right of every living person to determine his own path and his own life according to his own thoughts and wishes.

If he wants to have enough children for two football teams, and he can find a partner to do it with him, that is his CHOICE, But if he wants no children at all, that, too, is his CHOICE.

Personal autonomy. Personal freedom. Personal responsibilities. Personal thoughts, feelings, likes, and dislikes. And the right to make choices based on them.

Have you ever considered that depression is rampant because society puts too much pressure on people to conform to the herd, against their own best instincts as individuals? Get rid of the pressure by allowing people their individuality and their choices, and you get rid of the depression that goes with it.

Chimera said...

Hilary, I Googled.


Not what I'm talking about.